Re: Well, too interesting to drop all of the posts in this

Comments inline.

On Wed, 28 Jul 2004, Yves Lefebvre wrote:

> At 01:04 PM 2004-07-27 -0700, you wrote:
>>
>> --- Yves Lefebvre <ivanohe@abacom.com> wrote:
>>
>>> I think this might slow down the game for 3 reasons
>>> :
>>>
>>> - You have to remember more stat (as opposed to 1
>>> value that you add 1 or
>>> not depending if it's the front) or take the time to
>>> look it up on your
>>> data sheet.
>>
>> Wow, and looking down to see that "2" or "3" next to
>> your tank's side will take all of what, 5 seconds?  I
>> don't see this as being all that difficult.
>>
>
> Problem is that when you're planning your move, you may need to check
all
> your opponent vehicule armor value to be sure to be at the right place
when
> you fire. That's means a lot more planning and longer game turns. I'm
not
> sure this will enhance the game experience that much for the
additionnal
> time spent.
>
>

And where exactly does it say that you can look at my sheets to
determine 
what my armor is on any given vehicle at any given time?  I know that it

doesn't say that you can't do it, but quite frankly, if my opponent 
demanded to look over my sheets during the game, and spent extra time to

plan his attacks to be opimized for my armor, I'd be finding new 
opponents.

>>> - Might create more argument about the angle of >>> attack : Since
you can
>>> have, let say, front armor 8 and side 3, some degree
>>> (angle) will do a big
>>> difference. Since not all people play with vehicule
>>> bases, determining
>>> precisely which side get hit is problematic and will
>>> be lot more important
>>> than it is now.
>>
>> So establish a clearer more definitive rule for
>> determining angle of attack.
>
> The movement system is quite abstract (you can change your ending
facing).
> Putting more importance on angle of attack would likely means you need
a
> more complexe movement system.
>

No it doesn't.	Yes, you can set your facing however you want at the end

of your move, but it's	FIFTEEN MINUTE TURN.  Hell, I can face my car 
anyway I want in a small alley in under 1 minute.  You can't do this on 
open ground with a tank??

Once the oppenent has moved, if you *had the movement* to get into a 
flanking position, then you could react and do flanking shots.	I stand
my 
earlier contention that the movement rates in the game combined with the

weapons ranges inhibit the ability to outflank anything.  The general 
movement system doesn't need to be changed to be more restrictive unless

you adjust the time scale to make it more realistic.

>>> - Having bigger front armor value will make the
>>> vehicule harder to destroy,
>>> thus making the game last longer.
>>>
>>> Personnaly, I like the lenght of game that DS2
>>> gives. The current armor
>>> rule may not reflect reality but are good for the
>>> game itself.
>>
>> I can't really think that's a serious concern.  But if
>> you really want to limit armor to make games go
>> faster, then establish limits to armor as part of the
>> design system you use.  Remember, a lot of this is
>> predicated upon making the costing system independent
>> of the construction rules, so that you can come up
>> with a myriad of different design parameters, but a
>> uniform system for determining the combat value of the
>> vehicles.  So if you don't WANT more powerful armor,
>> don't ALLOW it in your game.
>
> Changing the "default" length of the game can be serious. If new
people try
> this game and find it last forever (or too short), it's not good. I
find
> DS2 to be quite ideal in game length. People I show the game also find
this
> a selling point.
>

Yes, it can.  And if anything, DSII resolves too slowly.  I'm strongly 
opposed to anything that will slow it down further.

> Sure, you say people can put limitation on design, but you should see
if
> the majority prefer longer game or not. If not, people who prefer
longer
> game could do the tweak themself.
>

I don't agree that most of what has been discussed would lengthen the
game 
significantly, unless you were allow for a significant increase in
frontal 
armor without adjusting speeds to allow for flanking fire.

<shrug>

J