RE: [SG] Smoke

At 5:08 PM -0500 10/30/02, Adrian Johnson wrote:
>
>Two reasons, mainly.  Smoke can be used tactically - ie not just
chucked
>randomly about, but rather *placed* exactly where you want it.  To be
able
>to position smoke grenades, whether or not they're fired from a rifle's
GL
>or thrown, requires a certain degree of "aiming", and if I can aim a
smoke
>grenade accurately to a spot within 60 meters of my position, why can't
I
>do the same thing with an explosive grenade?  Second reason is the
range.
>Smoke can be deployed up to 6" from the squad - 60 m.	A squad that is

I'm not sure why you're going to be throwing it 60 meters from you. 
You should be able to toss it over the nearest cover that's between 
you and the firing unit(s). One can throw a grenade nearby in a 
roughly random fashion without hardly any exposure.

A smoke grenade doesn't need to be placed in the cover of the 
target(s). It just needs to be where it will emit smoke that will 
bloom into a cloud that will cover your position.

Requiring a Quality test just like one uses to go into position seems 
quite rational.

>suppressed is assumed to be ducking behind whatever cover is available
and
>hunkering down to avoid incoming fire.  Try throwing a grenade (or
rock, or
>baseball, or whater) while you're lying down behind a bush.  How far do
you
>think you can throw?  60 meters?  Not bleedin' likely.  To be able to
>*accurately* (we get back to the "used tactically" issue) throw
something
>60 m, one has to be able to *at least* get to one's knees (if strong),
and
>probably be on foot.  Or using a grenade launcher, and aiming.  And
again,
>if I can do it with smoke, why can't I do it with explosive grenades?

You have to get that HE grenade in and among the bad guys. Not just 
near you upwind.

>If squads that are suppressed are allowed to throw smoke grenades to
60m,
>but aren't allowed to throw *explosive* hand grenades at an enemy squad
>that is 60m away... that creates a situation that doesn't make sense.

One has to be aimed far more purposfully.

>So, we play that "blowing smoke" is a fire action, and can't be done
while
>suppressed.
>
>However... I started off by saying "...not just chucked randomly
about..."
>What happens if that is *exactly* what someone would like to do - ie
have
>each squad member activate a smoke grenade at his current position, and
>roll it away just a meter or two.  In effect, the squad "blows smoke"
on
>its' current position, and in-game, the squad gets covered with smoke
>markers.  I've seen that tactic used a number of times.  From a "real
life"
>perspective, it sort of makes sense IF the squad has the means to avoid
>incapacitation by the smoke (ie the smoke is produced by some means
that
>doesn't make it difficult for them to breathe, or they all have
respirators
>or something).  It does mean the squad can't see anybody around them,
but
>conversely, within the rules, they can't be shot at.

There are mechanisms of making smoke that isn't incapacitating. I 
actually covered this. Whether it will be hot IR blocking smoke is 
another question though. The simplest smoke vaporizes glycerin or 
mineral oil which coalesces around dust particles and attracts water 
vapor. You can do this with a thrown grenade just like you can with a 
smoke machine.

>There doesn't seem to be any "rules" reason to prevent people from
"blowing
>smoke" on their own position (and my jury is out on whether this counts
as
>"cheesy" or not), and if they want to do that, why wouldn't they be
able to
>do it while suppressed?  It doesn't require the same kind of aiming
effort
>that accurately placing smoke grenades 60m would.

How difficult would it for a grunt in a squad to pop a green or 
purple smoke marker for identification?

>However... if you interpret "suppression" as being mostly psychological
(ie
>the troops are freaked out, and aren't doing anything because they are
>scared to death and are huddling down), then we're back to "no smoke" -
>they're just not thinking straight enough to do this either...

But Vets get suppressed too. Its a question of partially that, 
partially survival instinct because of the fire and partially good 
sense.

-- 
--
Ryan Gill	       rmgill@SPAMmindspring.com
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