Re: [Ft} OU & IC & FB3
From: "Alan and Carmel Brain" <aebrain@d...>
Date: Sat, 30 Dec 2000 11:29:47 +1100
Subject: Re: [Ft} OU & IC & FB3
Richard Hofrichter, where are you?
I've just had a look at the Indonesian ships in the ship registry.
I haven't seen them before. Yet they make perfect opponents
for the OU designs I made, some of which have made it to
the ship registry, the majority haven't.
Just similar enough in design philosophy (mainly in weaponry)
that they could well have "co-evolved". Just different enough
to have distinct flavours.
I think there's quite enough now for FB3. St Jon the Divine is
obviously over-worked, and what with Bugs Don't Surf etc could
do with all the acting-unpaid-supernumary help he could get.
So....
Here's an immodest proposal: That we get the ball rolling re a
possible FB3 (assuming Jon Tuffley esq doesn't object). I say
"possible" because he's under no obligation to use any of it -
but if there were great hunks of text in near-camera-ready form,
SSDs worked out, checked, play-balanced etc we could save
him some time.
Payment (if you're lucky!) would be at most 1 copy of the final
product.
Difficulties:
a) Miniature availability. I'd like to include some ships that haven't
been designed yet.
b) Line Artwork. The excellent line art in FB1, FB2 should be continued,
but only Jon T can organise this.
OK, so what *should* be in FB3?
a) Errata to date.
(Warning! Controversy!)
b) Balancing of KV, Phalons, SuVasku. In Cinematic movement,
the KV are over-costed by as much as 10%. Some people here
think 15%, and this is the figure used by the estimable Brendan Pratt
at Cancon. (He's won it 2 years running, the best I've managed is 3rd
so he knows what he's on about).
http://members.optusnet.com.au/~cgs/Blurbs2001.html#FULL%20THRUST
Sa'Vasku range bands altered to 8" bands.
Point defences treat Plasma Bolts as normal targets with no re-rolls
(1-3=
0pts 4-5= 1pts 6= 2pts).
Close range set pulsers only yield 4d6.
Kra'Vak point costs are reduced by 15%.
The highly esteemed OO has produced many good arguments that the Pulser
at Close Range should be 6 dice not 4. All I can say is that if you find
this to
be the case, use Medium or Long instead. In our playtesting, Cinematic
on
table-tennis tables, terrain so no floating - which I think is a very
large
proportion of the total FT audience - then close range pulsars are de
rigeur
at 6dice.
c) Fleets. We should at least have all the ships that GZG currently
make.
Anything else?
IC forex?
d) Rules: What rules do we need: MT missiles, for sure. Anything else?
From - Wed Jan 03 11:05:58 2001
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From: Allan Goodall <awg@sympatico.ca>
To: gzg-l@csua.berkeley.edu
Subject: Re: [SG2] Questions
Date: Fri, 29 Dec 2000 20:45:39 -0500
Organization: Haphazard at best.
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References:
<9DB05BB477A8D111AF3F00805F5730100D100744@exchange01.dscc.dla.mil>
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On Fri, 29 Dec 2000 10:49:18 -0500, "Bell, Brian K (Contractor)"
<Brian.Bell@dscc.dla.mil> wrote:
>[Bri] Hmmm. The rules seem to contradict themselves.
Yes, they do.
>A non-penetrating
>hit would seem to place the vehicle under suppression. Page 18 states
>that suppression on a vehicle prohibits the crew from exiting the
vehicle.
The rule on page 18 states that a vehicle will take a Suppression marker
in...
uh... cases where the vehicle would take suppression. This is implied to
mean
that a minor hit, or a non-penetrating major hit, will apply a
suppression
marker.
So, a non-penetrating hit MUST place a suppression marker. That's a
given.
The rule on page 39 states that a non-penetrating hit causes a
Confidence
Test, failure of which means the vehicle occupants MUST leave the
vehicle.
It is possible to have a Suppression on a vehicle while not hitting it.
It is
impossible to have a non-penetrating hit without also having a
Suppression.
The rule requires you to leave the vehicle when you test Confidence
after a
non-penetrating hit. So, I interpret the forced bailing of a hit vehicle
to
override the "can't leave the vehicle if suppressed" rule. I interpret
that as
"can't voluntarily leave the vehicle if suppressed".
>I would say that, no the crew would not leave the vehicle until the
>suppression was removed. But I would suggest a house rule that the crew
>could not perform combat actions until they succeeded in the confidence
>check or remove the suppression marker.
That actually goes against the rule that says vehicle occupants are not
stopped from performing actions in a suppressed vehicle. It also means,
in a
big game, you'll have to have some way of indicating vehicles that were
suppressed from vehicles that were suppressed and failed a
non-penetrating hit
confidence test.
In the interest of simplicity, the interpretation that the failed
Confidence
Test forces a bail out regardless of suppression is the easiest to use.
>[Bri] Yes, if a sniper chooses to use normal movement instead of
>hidden movement, he is placed on the table. I doubt that this would
happen
>unless the sniper decided that leaving quickly was a better option than
>staying hidden.
I've seen it happen in cases where a sniper decides to become part of a
squad.
I've also seen it happen in scenarios where a sniper had to escape from
a
board or moved to occupy a terrain feature for victory conditions.
Allan Goodall awg@sympatico.ca
Goodall's Grotto: http://www.vex.net/~agoodall
"Surprisingly, when you throw two naked women with sex
toys into a living room full of drunken men, things
always go bad." - Kyle Baker, "You Are Here"
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From: "Robert W. Hofrichter" <RobHofrich@peoplepc.com>
To: <gzg-l@csua.berkeley.edu>
References: <200012291552.eBTFqap56164@soda.csua.berkeley.edu>
Subject: Re: [Ft} FBII Ship Bits
Date: Fri, 29 Dec 2000 20:58:03 -0500
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I've got Kra'Vak, but no Phalon or Sa'Vasku at my geocities site.
www.geocities.com/rwhofrichter/
Sorry.
Rob
----- Original Message -----
From: <johncrim@voicenet.com>
To: <gzg-l@csua.berkeley.edu>
Sent: Friday, December 29, 2000 5:52 AM
Subject: [Ft} FBII Ship Bits
> Has anyone created a .gif or .jpg of the Fleetbook II systems yet?
I'm
trying to get all
> of my ships written up and ready to go, and I need Phalon and Sa'Vasku
icons to prepare
> those fleets.
>
> John Crimmins
> johncrim@voicenet.com
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------
> This message was sent using Voicenet WebMail.
> http://www.voicenet.com/webmail/
>
>
>
>
From - Wed Jan 03 11:05:59 2001
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<007d01c071f7$b079b180$3b478bca@avis>
Subject: Re: [Ft} OU & IC & FB3
Date: Fri, 29 Dec 2000 21:53:16 -0500
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Actually, that's "Robert Hofrichter!"
Richard is my brother's name, and while he occassionally games,
miniatures
are not his style.
My site is up and running again at rwhofrichter.webprovider.com but I
will
be posting all of my FT/FB designs not on the webprovider site to my
geocities page in the near future. That would be Dutch, IC, RH, and OU.
There will be some overlap, as some of the Dutch, IC and RH designs are
already on my webprovider page (the FT scenario includes ship designs).
For some reason, most of my recent e-mails to the mail list haven't made
it
on, so if I've repeated something I've posted before, it's because I
can't
remember what actually made it and what didn't!
Rob
----- Original Message -----
From: "Alan and Carmel Brain" <aebrain@dynamite.com.au>
To: <gzg-l@csua.berkeley.edu>
Sent: Friday, December 29, 2000 7:29 PM
Subject: Re: [Ft} OU & IC & FB3
> Richard Hofrichter, where are you?
>
> I've just had a look at the Indonesian ships in the ship registry.
> I haven't seen them before. Yet they make perfect opponents
> for the OU designs I made, some of which have made it to
> the ship registry, the majority haven't.
> Just similar enough in design philosophy (mainly in weaponry)
> that they could well have "co-evolved". Just different enough
> to have distinct flavours.
>
> I think there's quite enough now for FB3. St Jon the Divine is
> obviously over-worked, and what with Bugs Don't Surf etc could
> do with all the acting-unpaid-supernumary help he could get.
>
> So....
>
> Here's an immodest proposal: That we get the ball rolling re a
> possible FB3 (assuming Jon Tuffley esq doesn't object). I say
> "possible" because he's under no obligation to use any of it -
> but if there were great hunks of text in near-camera-ready form,
> SSDs worked out, checked, play-balanced etc we could save
> him some time.
> Payment (if you're lucky!) would be at most 1 copy of the final
> product.
>
> Difficulties:
> a) Miniature availability. I'd like to include some ships that haven't
> been designed yet.
> b) Line Artwork. The excellent line art in FB1, FB2 should be
continued,
> but only Jon T can organise this.
>
> OK, so what *should* be in FB3?
>
> a) Errata to date.
>
> (Warning! Controversy!)
> b) Balancing of KV, Phalons, SuVasku. In Cinematic movement,
> the KV are over-costed by as much as 10%. Some people here
> think 15%, and this is the figure used by the estimable Brendan Pratt
> at Cancon. (He's won it 2 years running, the best I've managed is 3rd
> so he knows what he's on about).
> http://members.optusnet.com.au/~cgs/Blurbs2001.html#FULL%20THRUST
> Sa'Vasku range bands altered to 8" bands.
> Point defences treat Plasma Bolts as normal targets with no re-rolls
(1-3=
> 0pts 4-5= 1pts 6= 2pts).
> Close range set pulsers only yield 4d6.
> Kra'Vak point costs are reduced by 15%.
>
> The highly esteemed OO has produced many good arguments that the
Pulser
> at Close Range should be 6 dice not 4. All I can say is that if you
find
> this to
> be the case, use Medium or Long instead. In our playtesting, Cinematic
on
> table-tennis tables, terrain so no floating - which I think is a very
large
> proportion of the total FT audience - then close range pulsars are de
rigeur
> at 6dice.
>
> c) Fleets. We should at least have all the ships that GZG currently
make.
> Anything else?
> IC forex?
>
> d) Rules: What rules do we need: MT missiles, for sure. Anything else?
>
>
>
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From: Brian Burger <yh728@victoria.tc.ca>
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Subject: Re: Ship Names
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On Thu, 28 Dec 2000, Chris DeBoe wrote:
> Murphy et al, Attys, also known as Muphy's Lawyers, have two light
cruisers
> configured for special operations plus approximately six Night Vision
and
> Night Music recon/elint corvettes. Murphy et al, based in the Huy
Braseal
> system of the Alarishi Empire, offers "discrete services" (which
include
> counterpiracy ops, sabotage, subversion and disinformation) in
addition to
> their more usual legal and arbitration services. The cruisers are
> designated Julia and Mandelbrot.
Murphy & Co sound like one of the many reasons why some powers consider
the 'Alarish Empire' to be little more than a nest of pirate dens...
See the history of the US Navy & Barbary pirates for what happens to
pirate states that offend even second-rank powers. (very early 19th C)
There's a reason that US Marine hymn contains the line about 'the shores
of Tripoli'...
I do, however, like the cruiser names. They must be referred to as the
Fractal-class cruisers...
Brian - yh728@victoria.tc.ca -
- http://warbard.iwarp.com/games.html -
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From: "Laserlight" <laserlight@quixnet.net>
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Subject: Re: [FT] OU & IC & FB3
Date: Fri, 29 Dec 2000 22:35:08 -0800
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From: Alan Brain
> Here's an immodest proposal: That we get the ball rolling re a
> possible FB3 (assuming Jon Tuffley esq doesn't object).
Hear, hear!
> OK, so what *should* be in FB3?
> c) Fleets. We should at least have all the ships that GZG currently
make.
I am working on Islamic Fed, of course, and eagerly awaiting the next
batch of minis--cruisers, IIRC--due out (per St^3 Jon in October) Any
Time Now. Note that these are Designs That Conform To The Minis, not
the asymetric designs on my page.
> d) Rules: What rules do we need: MT missiles, for sure. Anything
else?
--Variable maneuverability. I'd like to be able to build SDN that can
thrust 4 in a straight line but maneuver like an arthritic hippo; I
want FF's that can't necessarily outrace a CL over the long haul but
can turn on a dime and leave you nine cents change. And it's easy
enough to implement.
--I'd like a grand tactical system like the one someone proposed a
couple of weeks ago--sorry I don't recall who, it's on my computer at
work--something about "imagine three concentric circles around the
battle area, for each turn of pre-battle maneuvering you can close by
one space or change clockface entry point by one". Not complicated
but enough to allow more maneuvering than simply "you enter at North,
I enter at South, at the double, charge!" And it would allow an easy
tie-in of Stealth as well.
--Possibly a paragraph or two on sample fleet organization, since
that's a question that seems to recur fairly often here.
From - Wed Jan 03 11:06:07 2001
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From: "bif smith" <bif@bifsmith.fsnet.co.uk>
To: "full thrust" <gzg-l@csua.berkeley.edu>
Subject: RE-[FT]FB3
Date: Sat, 30 Dec 2000 13:25:04 -0000
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A & C Brain said-
>d) Rules: What rules do we need: MT missiles, for sure. Anything else?
I agree with the need for MT missiles to be revised, because compairing
them
to SML`s, the performance is severly (by 30%, in my opinion) lacking. We
could have MT missiles moving like fighters, variable thrust/endurance
ratios etc. Also, how about different warheads? We have needle, emp and
nuke
warheads, so how about a X-RAY laser nuclear detonation powered beam
warhead
(I know this was tried with little sucess in some underground
detonations
(or so they say), but there is no physics reason for it not to work in
the
future). This would allow some of the more interesting SF novels (I
didn`t
say HH) to be played. My sugestion is that when you reach 6MU (or
whatever
the attack range is) of your target, you roll a 1D6 for the number of
beams
that hit, and roll 2D6 for dammage of each beam the same as beam weapons
(1-3=no dammage, 4-5=1 DP, 6=2 DP + reroll). Being a laser (not the
postulated partical beams used), the weapon would ignore sheilds. This
weapon would also be able to target ships in it`s rear arc (the warhead
separates from the missile, and the reaction/maneuvering systems
orentate it
to point in the direction of it`s target). This would require a cost a
lot
higher than normal missiles, due to the dammage being a lot greater (eg-
x4
mass?).
How about a simple (so I can understand it) campaign system including
ship
construction/ship yard systems? And, for construction rules, how about
what
is required for immobile satilites/spacestations (what mass is required
for
a powerplant and orbital maneuvering drive?). Also, how about different
intersteller voyage time for different ships (say based on the thrust of
the
enstien space drive), instead of as at present that every ship crosses
the
stars at the same rate (this would make smaller, faster ships more
useful as
a rapid reaction force to enemy movements).
Fleet orginisations?-Yes, I`d like to see at lest something along those
lines myself (eg-are NAC squadrens orginised along the lines of ship
classes
(eg-6x BB or 2x BB, 2x CA, 2x DD?).
And finally, how about a better sensor/ECM rules than as at present,
that
also allow the differences to be used in battles (eg-a week ship with
lots
of ecm vs a strong ship with no ecm).
BIF
"yorkshire born,yorkshire bred,
strong in arms, thick in head"