Re: GZG DS2 Mikko: Genres for DS2.

Mikko Kurki-Suonio <maxxon@swob.dna.fi> wrote:
>"An alarm pinged to warn him that a laser rangefinder painted
>Deathdealer's armour. The gunnery computer was already rotating the
turret,
>while a pulsing red highlight arrowed the source: an anti-tank missile
>launched twelve-hundred meters away..." - David Drake, Rolling Hot,
1989
>
>"post-mounted missile systems, both guided and hypervelocity" - David
>Drake, The Warrior, 1991
    Notice the dates? His older stories use wireguided missiles! In this
later story, he's upgraded his missile technology! But the way that the
tank
is dealing with the missile is still the same, which is take out the
operator and the missile as the missile is launching, not as the missile
is
about to impact!

>Technically, these bits don't speak of the actual guidance mechanism,
but
>I submit my final bit of evidence as to *how* they are dealt with:
>"Reconnaissance satellites, computer fire control, and powerguns
combined
>to claw *missiles* out of the air before they were dangerous. ...
locked
>defensive weapons on the *missiles* in microseconds. And a single
>light-swift tribarrel could hose any *missile* with enough fire in its
>seconds of flight to disintegrate it." - David Drake, Interlude:
>Supertanks, 1979 (emphasis added)
    Thanks for the quote! I was going to quote it back to you! It's in
the
short story collection I also have. Where it ALSO speaks about wire
guided
missiles. The technique of firing at the operator and the missile with
main
gun and MG is a technique developed by the Israelis in the Arab-Israeli
conflicts and transferred to the Americans. David Drake has logically
extended this technique to fire light speed power guns at the missile
operator, so that the operator ducks and the missile misses.

>>     HS combat cars were open topped because they were based on a old
Soviet
>> apc which was open topped. I get the impression David Drake didn't
like
>> M113s!
>
>"Hammer's vehicles were designed around the M48s and [M113] ACAVs I'd
>ridden..." - David Drake, Afterword to Counting the Cost, 1987
    That's right, but if you look closer in the stories, you will find
that
the combat cars are completely open topped at the rear, which is not
quite
the case with the M113 ACAV, which had hatches. David Drake has extended
it
quite logically and completely open topped the rear of the combat cars.
The
driver has overhead protection, the soldiers don't!
    In the short story collection, they mention open topped combat cars
frequently. In one story, a air conditioned, fully enclosed combat car
was
mentioned as being the bait to trap some enemy.

>>     HS also isn't NBC capable. Their rules of war didn't allow NBC
>>weapons to be used.
>List of examples snipped.
    Yes, they used Nukes and chemicals against others but themselves
were
not capable of resisting it, which is what I meant to say. For example,
open
topped combat cars and body armour and helmets that were not NBC
resistant,
but were open construction. There is a quote in the short story
collection,
where a soldier's beard is shown hanging underneath his helmet. Also, in
the
short story collection, David Drake describes the open REAR howitzers.

>"The political soldiers had naively failed to consider gas. The
Slammers
>introduced KD7 into the forced ventilation system, then spent three
days
>neutralising the toxin..." - David Drake, Standing Down, 1979
    Three days neutralising it. No NBC protection equipment! Not that
they
needed it, of course, in that situation! In another story in the short
story
collection, they detonate a gas shell in a alien lair and blow the gas
deeper into it. None of the team put on protective clothing or closed
hatches. Therefore, if Biological or chemical attacks were used against
Hammer's Slammers, they would be in deep trouble!
    Also their Nuclear dampers, while not described that well, obviously
weren't cheap. They were not used by plattoons of vehicles. They seemed
to
be a large, expensive item of gear. In that same story, no nuclear
damper
was provided to the troops. Therefore, no nuclear protection. Therefore,
as
whole, HS were not NBC capable.

>>     In David Drake's military experience, there was no terrain
following,
>>no Nap of Earth flying and no multimach ground attack aeroplanes.
>"Similar weaponry was mounted on helicopters which skimmed battlefields
>in the nape of the earth, protected by terrain irregularities. At the
last
>instant the birds could pop up to rip tanks with their missiles."
-David
>Drake, Interlude: Supertanks, 1979
    Yes, there were helicopters, but no planes that could fly NOE in his
experience! These NOE aircraft techniques were developed later. This
interlude is in my short story collection. The technique of firing main
gun
and MG at helicopter which were having to stay still to wire guide
missiles
is still effective.

>>     They didn't have PDS in the stories! Therefore it's not allowed
by
>> the genre!
>Erm, isn't shooting down missiles exactly what PDS does? Fill in the
>blank: If a computer-controlled tribarrel automatically tries to shoot
>down an incoming missile, it is functioning as a ... system.
    Sorry, it's not shooting an incoming missile. It's shooting at the
operator and the missile while it's starting to launch. It's a logical
extension of the Israeli technique. Read further and see that the
computer
control is causing the tribarrel to fire at the satellite detected
launching
flash, NOT at the missile in full flight. This is significantly easier
to
do than to intercept a high speed, fire and forget, missile, just before
it
impacts with your vehicle. The PDS system shoots down missiles as they
are
about to impact NOT as they launch.

>Maybe your Drake books came from an alternate universe?
    I haven't got the latest ones where David Drake changes his
technology.
I've got his older short story collection which is based on his
experiences
in Vietnam, logically extended into the future.

Andrew Martin
Shared email: Al.Bri@xtra.co.nz
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