Re: AMERICANS

> Y'ALL KNOW,  if the USA had stayed home and minded its own business
and
> said piss off to the rest of the enlightened	countries of the world
in
> the 20th Century, the ones of you that were not speaking German or
> Japanese,  Italian, Chinese, or  Russian, would certainly be leading
> diferent lives than the ones you lead today.

Actually, if we stayed out of World War I, the world would be a much
different place.  Germany probably would have defeated France, and held
onto
Alsace Lorainne and "historical Poland" less the part held onto by the
Austro-Hungarian Empire (assuming it survived, which is rather
doubtful).
The Nazi's would not have come to power, and the Soviet Union would have
been smaller and with a lot less population.  Stalin would still have
probably have come to power, and he probably would have still planned a
war
with Germany.  That would have been a very interesting war, because
there
would have been no purge of the Soviet officiers before the war.  Stalin
got
the idea of purges from Hitler's Kristalnacht (Stalin wasn't a very
original
thinker, and tend to do things to excess).  What would have happened
from
there is hard to say, but I doubt the world would be a worse place then
it
is today.

Now what would have been much better would have been if the U.S. and
Great
Britian had stayed out of the war.  France probably would have been
defeated
in 1914, 1915 at the latest.  Russia would not have been able to hold
out
long against Germany alone.  I suspect the czar would have sued for
peace
with the condition of not territorial changes from the start of the war.
The Soviets would then probably not have come to power at all in Russia,
and
the world would be a much, much different place then it is today, and
probably better.

> and of course our Russian allies, had  made a peace treaty with the
> Japanese so they could  concentrate of the Axis.

When was the last time you tried to fight a war with the bulk of your
industry and population on the far side of Asia?  They tried this in
1904-1905 and it was a nightmare.  In World War I they had mountains of
supplies stacked up (mostly from the U.S.) in Vladivostock then they
could
ever hope to move to the west.	In the skirmishes with Japan in the
1930's
they still had a logistical nightmare.

> and they still used huge quantities of American manufactured machines,
> weapons, ammo,  clothing and food in their  war against the Axis .

Well I should hope so.	If the Soviets had fallen, defeating Hitler
would
have been much tougher.

> this does not reduce the importance of  Russian actions in WW II as an
> ally, but remember, they also  co-invaded Poland.

Well of course, Stalin wanted to get closer to Berlin.	It would make
his
planned invasion of Germany (in the mid 1940's) that much easier...

> having talked with many old  landsers, upon reflection they admit 
that
> Reich did as much to defeat the Reich as any	of the ALLIEs.	some
> interesting reading about  Germany's war time production  and
political
> decisions that limited it also will provide some clues to problems
> created by the Reich	for the Reich.

Bureaucratic stupidity is universal.  Look at the U.S. Navy Bureau Ord.
and
the mess with U.S. torpedoes at the beginning of the U.S. operations in
World War II.  But the Reich had it worse then the U.S., fortunately.

> i seem to remember that America supplied arms, ammo, equipment,
> vehicles, ships, aircraft,  training facilities, food, medicine,
medical
> technology,  POW  storage and etc  for THE ALLIES, all the while
> fighting its own war.
>
> and i do not "wrap myself in an American flag" as some of you like to
> say.

You don't, but John Atkinson is another matter.

> i can tell the difference between right, wrong, and do not give a shit
> too.
>
> but, i do not like the patronizing tone,
> DEREK is displaying towards America  and Americans,  or that a lot of
> y'all are showing.

This American hasn't liked John Atkinson's anti-rest of the world tone
for a
LONG TIME.

> maybe we should have sayed home and left y'all  folks ancestors to
> sizzle in their own shit instead of bailing you out, rebuilding you,
and
> protecting you with OUR MONEY and OUR BLOOD . . .

If we had stayed out of World War I, we probably wouldn't have need to
get
involved in World War II (Imperial Germany versus the Soviets), and
there
probably never would have been a cold war...

ias