Re: Stargrunt II question

> The Reaction Fire rule (see p.53) was meant to cover this type of
> situation, but as you point out, this rule does not apply in your
example
> because the unit only used ONE action for movement.

I could see that, it just seems somewhat inadequate to cover the 
case I'm talking about. 
 
> Bear in mind that if both squads A and B are NOT on the edge of the
clumps
> then the situation you describe cannot happen - you cannot fire on a
target
> that is not on the edge of a wood.

> If _both_ are on the edge of the clumps then neither needs to move in
order
> to fire -  7" is pretty close range for most weapons.

The replies I've received show that I've picked a bad description of 
the problem since everyone is hung up on 'woods' element. I just used 
that as a 'setting'. It wasn't really germaine to the problem.

If you focus on the fact that a unit can move between 20m and 120m in 
plain sight of the enemy, and then conduct another action (except 
movement) without any interruption, even though the entire enemy 
force might be sitting there watching them, waiting to fire when they 
reach optimal range, you appreciate the problem. A unit can dash from 
medium or long range to short range IN PLAIN SIGHT THE WHOLE WAY in 
the face of a WAITING ARMED enemy and then conduct another action 
(Reorganize, Fire, etc.) all before the observing enemy can open 
fire. That is the problem. Ignore the woods. 

Also, I realize 70m is close to close assault distance. Lets pick an 
even more contrived (no terrain involved, both A and B start 
140 m apart in the open) example where they (the moving force, B in 
my previous examples) are 140 m out, then they activate and dash 120m 
as there combat move (leaving them 20 m from A), and then fire 
(probably very effectively) at the patiently waiting-to-die formation 
A whose only goal in life was to engage B at 60 m. Now one can (I 
believe fatuously) argue that A should have activated and fired at B 
at 140m or that B dashed so fast they caught A by surprise, but that 
140 m dash might be from long range to short! And a dash from long to 
short where the prepared defending player can't engage you seems just 
wrong. I mean, I've been a member of a squad in contact with other 
units closing by rapid bounds or Advance-To-Contact drill if you 
prefer, and even when the defenders (us) were disorganized as any 
group of ten or less guys could really be, there is no way that an 
enemy force could have moved from a long range into an effective or 
short range without us at least getting the opportunity to put rounds 
downrange and engage them. Covering 20 to 120m in the sight of a 
stationary foe who might have the inclination to fire upon you is 
generally speaking an undesirable situation (I might go so far as to 
suggest it is a recurrent nightmare of most ground pounders), let 
alone conducting some other action in plain sight afterwards!. My 
Infantry CO always said you wanted to fight dead and dying soldiers, 
not living, breathing, awake and aware men with weapons and an 
inclination to use them. Sometimes you have to 'run into the guns' 
but it should be a scenario where you pretty much expect to take 
brutal casualties because you don't have any choice. You should never 
expect to be able to charge a prepared position and (with a lucky die 
roll) cover the distance before they can fire..... I think any 
infantry commander that depended on this tactic under normal 
circumstances would be court martialled. Without some for of 
Overwatch or Gaurd, it seems to me that (assuming mean roll of 3.5 
on your combat move) you stand a pretty decent chance of covering 70m 
(enough to take you from medium range to short, and if you roll good, 
enough to take you from much further out, perhaps long range, to 
short) AND then conducting a fire action before the emplaced enemy 
can reply. 

> The initiative is in fact with the squad that moves. Because the
distance
> is short then it should probably be dealt with by a close assault.

See above for at least one example of something that probably 
couldn't be dealt with as a close assault - 120m out to start with, 
roll average combat move 70m (yes I realize you'd actually have 80m 
or 60m, but I'm talking mean distance) and you are inside short range 
and firing away at the enemy before they can take the volley they've 
been waiting to shoot, despite having moved your movement in their 
sights). 

> You will usually find that careful interpretation of the rules will
resolve
> most issues.

Agreed. The rules are well written (as an aside, GZG has done a 
much better job of writing concise, clear and well edited rules as 
compared to industry gaming giants like TSR - who should probably 
fire the copy editors on their latest set of hardcovers) and 
playable. 

But I think a house rule like some form of Gaurd or 
Overwatch action might be worth playtesting. Like I said, I'll post 
the URL maybe later tonight or tomorrow once I transform my ideas 
into HTML and people can try it out or not as they see fit. If no one 
likes it but me, then I'll be the only one to use it. If it is 
simple, and others like it, then it might be a good idea.  Defenders 
traditionally have been given at least a 2:1 advantage vs. attackers 
(hence why you attack at 3:1 minimum if you can swing it), and the 
fact that they can watch you advance and pick effecive moments to 
fire is probably part of that. 

> Any comments, Jon?

I'm interested to here anything that Jon might have to contribute. 
BTW, thanks for the input Mike! Keep up the good work guys. I've seen 
and played at least 20 wargames and this has the most elegant rule 
system which still simulated a lot of circumstances. I'm happy 
(despite appearances to the contrary) with the rules! 

Tom. 
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