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Re: [GZG] FT:XD changes, part 1

From: Damond Walker <damosan@g...>
Date: Mon, 3 May 2010 16:30:26 -0400
Subject: Re: [GZG] FT:XD changes, part 1

There is also something to be said about thinking about a problem too

Isn't just about everything in FT situational in nature: armor,
screens, certain weapons tied to fast/slow platforms, movement styles,

(Granted some situations are bigger offenders than others - but it's
situational and difficult to account for.)

Can you really ever fix that?  No.

This is the trap of a points system - while there may be a good
solution out there somewhere the minute you get it out to the genpop
someone will break it.

You are always going to have edge cases that will break a system.  For
me the fleet books set the tone for my games and designs so I was
never really concerned about the system's edge cases.


On 5/3/10, Eric Foley <> wrote:
> -----Original Message-----
>>From: Damond Walker <>
>>On Mon, May 3, 2010 at 12:44 PM, Eric Foley <>
>>> To some degree, I agree... although if you allow easy fire at
>>> they just stop being effective.
>>They become less effective to be sure but they don't stop being
>>effective.  All this talk about fighters (for all these years) seems
>>to be keeping the rest of the system from moving forward.  Fighters
>>are much too cheap for what they bring to the table -- if everything
>>else stayed the same has anyone toyed with simply increasing the point
>>cost by 100% or so?  I'm sure someone has done this...
> "Fighters are too cheap for what they bring to the table"... this
> in and of itself, is not true, never has been, and never will be.  It
> _conditionally_ true if one side has a lot of fighters and the other
> has neither fighters nor a strong point defense.  It is quite false if
> side has a lot of fighters and the other side has a lot of point
> Fighters are not the only weapon in the game for which this is the
> it's only the simplest one to use.  I could go on for hours about
> examples.  (e.g. A fleet with all slow battleships with wide arc
direct fire
> weapons but without point defense will get killed by salvo missiles,
> get killed by Kra'Vak escort cruisers, which get killed by the slow
> battleships again.)  When it comes to custom games where all the
gloves are
> off, a lot of the pre-game strategy is about balancing out your fleets
> you are prepared for a wide variety of things your opponents could
> and giving up as few "skunk jobs" where you're just caught unprepared
> what they've got as possible -- and you have to play in a group where
> up a disastrous loss _because_ you gambled on something is considered
> worst case scenario (because in real wars, it is).  The end results of
> evolution can still be fun to play with, but they won't resemble the
> book ships _at_all_.
>>Thankfully I've only ever played small fleet games from the FBs so the
>>players couldn't easily bring hordes of fighters with them --
>>basically only light and fleet carriers.
> Yeah... and honestly, I do think that FB1 games are fun in their own
> but I think that if you want a game quantified reason why they stay
that way
> and don't evolve into a fighterfest with much stiffer point defenses,
> logistical limit on the number of fighters is the best way to go. 
Even at
> that, the FB2 powers kind of throw the balance off in a different
> altogether, because every one of them is better at either defending
> fighters or cranking them out themselves.
> E
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