help please (Dirtside)
From: "chubbybob" <bob@r...>
Date: Wed, 27 Dec 2000 22:29:37 +0100
Subject: help please (Dirtside)
Hi folks..
boy this game has really got a grip...?=0)
The ADS rules on page 31 of the DSII rules state that in order to engage
incoming missiles the vehicle must have its sensors active... fine no
argument with that but what penalty is there for having it operative.. I
may
have missed it but I can't find anywhere for wild weasel type actions or
radar homing missiles so why would you not have the sensors on for the
duration of the game???? what is the adverse effect of being active..
All help appreciated..
Bob DeAngelis
From - Wed Jan 03 11:05:18 2001
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From: "Owen Glover" <oglover@bigpond.net.au>
To: <gzg-l@csua.berkeley.edu>
Subject: RE: Proto SG2 campaign system
Date: Thu, 28 Dec 2000 09:15:11 +1100
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Hi Andy,
That is really a "how long is a piece of string" question. I saw the
replies
discussing the Tom Clancy ranges.
Current Range Tables for the 81mm Mortar is 4595m (yeah pedantic!!).
That is
without a Rocket Assist ammunition and without extrapolating advances in
munitions technology. The WWII 4.2" mortar had an effective range of
3000m
for what it is worth. The Soviet Vasilek Automatic 82mm Mortar has a
reported efective range of 5000m but spits out 60 rpm!! A Mechanised Bn
could be expected to have a platoon of these and be available for
tasking in
support of the Infantry Company.
But back to your question of what Indirect Fire may be available for Coy
Level? The lower calibre mortars; 50mm and 60mm are being looked at
seriously if not already adopted at Platoon and Company Level. Ranges
from
1,000m to 3,000m. For a whole host of reasons (but an example very
practical
one being weight restrictions for ammunition) heavier mortars are not
normally organic to Comapny organisation.
At Battalion level there is ALWAYS some form of Indirect Fire and the
Scales
of the force will dictate the type of support available and therefore
the
planning ranges for Fire Missions. For example Light Infantry will
likely
have man packable or light vehicle mounted mortars. Your 81mm/120mm with
ranges of perhaps 5,000m to 7,000m. Mechanised Infantry will probably
have
ligher artillery around the 105mm and ranges of perhaps 11,000m to
15,000m.
Now you may also have Artillery allocated from a higher level In Support
or
Under Command to the Battalion who can then allocate this down to
Company
level. So your ranges can be extended perhaps a little further. Towed
and
Self Propelled Arty could have ranges of out to perhaps the 24km range.
If you were talking purely organic Company Indirect Fire then unless the
force is Mechanised then you are unlikely to find anything more than the
small mortars which quite honetsly are best used for Illumination as the
size of the rounds and the volume of ammunition able to be carried will
severly limit the sustained fire capability.
I'm not sure if that has actually helped at all.
Cheers,
Owen
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-gzg-l@lists.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU
> [mailto:owner-gzg-l@lists.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU]On Behalf Of Andy Cowell
> Sent: Thursday, 28 December 2000 4:34 AM
> To: gzg-l@csua.berkeley.edu
> Subject: Re: Proto SG2 campaign system
>
>
> In message <200012271533.QAA19703@d1o901.telia.com>, "Oerjan
> Ohlson" writes:
> > Andy Cowell wrote:
> >
> > >I can't find my DS2 rules. What's the approximate range for
> > >Rocket Assisted Mortars?
> >
> > All DS2 artillery has "effectively unlimited" range - any point on
the
> > table, no matter if they're deployed on- or off-table themselves.
>
> I understand that, but I was really wondering if they gave anything
> more specific-- so I would know whether or not, in my SG2 game, I
> would be within range to call for fire support. We know they can
> cover the entire DS2 board, but what's the groundscale? Just looking
> for hard, numeric ranges.
>
> What sort of ranges would company level artillery typically have in
> terms of today's equipment?
>
>
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From: "Chris DeBoe" <LASERLIGHT@QUIXNET.NET>
To: <gzg-l@csua.berkeley.edu>
References: <200012272115.NAA15402@mail1.bigmailbox.com>
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Subject: Re: help please (Dirtside)
Date: Wed, 27 Dec 2000 18:05:00 -0500
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Don't have my rules here and I'm not a DS2 guru but I think you'll find
that
it's easier to spot, therefore hit, a vehicle with its ADS firecon lit
up.
----- Original Message -----
From: "chubbybob" <bob@retemail.es>
To: <gzg-l@csua.berkeley.edu>
Sent: Wednesday, December 27, 2000 4:29 PM
Subject: help please (Dirtside)
> Hi folks..
> boy this game has really got a grip...?=0)
> The ADS rules on page 31 of the DSII rules state that in order to
engage
> incoming missiles the vehicle must have its sensors active... fine no
> argument with that but what penalty is there for having it operative..
I
may
> have missed it but I can't find anywhere for wild weasel type actions
or
> radar homing missiles so why would you not have the sensors on for the
> duration of the game???? what is the adverse effect of being active..
> All help appreciated..
>
> Bob DeAngelis
>
From - Wed Jan 03 11:05:18 2001
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From: "Peter Mancini" <peter_mancini@msn.com>
To: gzg-l@csua.berkeley.edu
Subject: Re: St Jon - Exposed!
Date: Wed, 27 Dec 2000 18:21:35 -0500
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>From: "Dean Gundberg" <Dean.Gundberg@noridian.com>
>For those of us who have never had a chance to meet Mr. Jon Tuffley in
>person, or if you have ever wondered what a GZG booth looks like at a
UK
>convention, I just ran across some pictures of Bifrost 2000 on the web
>which has just those shots.
Wow, an amazing likeness to the 'Young' Harrison Ford...
Ok, I'll go play suckup else where now!
--Peter
_________________________________________________________________
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From: "chubbybob" <bob@retemail.es>
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Subject: Re: help please (Dirtside).. I found it..
Date: Thu, 28 Dec 2000 00:30:02 +0100
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Thanks for the response Chris but its not that.. There are no location
rules
in DSII.. I have just hunted through the rules and found the answer..
ADS
units with active sensors cannot fire at ground targets .. I do however
smell a wild weasel houserule coming on..heheheh
Bob deAngelis
----- Original Message -----
From: "Chris DeBoe" <LASERLIGHT@QUIXNET.NET>
To: <gzg-l@csua.berkeley.edu>
Sent: Thursday 28 de December de 2000 00:05
Subject: Re: help please (Dirtside)
> Don't have my rules here and I'm not a DS2 guru but I think you'll
find
that
> it's easier to spot, therefore hit, a vehicle with its ADS firecon lit
up.
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "chubbybob" <bob@retemail.es>
> To: <gzg-l@csua.berkeley.edu>
> Sent: Wednesday, December 27, 2000 4:29 PM
> Subject: help please (Dirtside)
>
>
> > Hi folks..
> > boy this game has really got a grip...?=0)
> > The ADS rules on page 31 of the DSII rules state that in order to
engage
> > incoming missiles the vehicle must have its sensors active... fine
no
> > argument with that but what penalty is there for having it
operative.. I
> may
> > have missed it but I can't find anywhere for wild weasel type
actions or
> > radar homing missiles so why would you not have the sensors on for
the
> > duration of the game???? what is the adverse effect of being
active..
> > All help appreciated..
> >
> > Bob DeAngelis
> >
>
From - Wed Jan 03 11:05:20 2001
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Date: Wed, 27 Dec 2000 16:02:29 -0800
To: gzg-l@csua.berkeley.edu
From: Ndege Diamond <nezach@earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: help please (Dirtside).. I found it..
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At 12:30 AM 12/28/00 +0100, you wrote:
>Thanks for the response Chris but its not that.. There are no location
rules
>in DSII.. I have just hunted through the rules and found the answer..
ADS
>units with active sensors cannot fire at ground targets .. I do however
>smell a wild weasel houserule coming on..heheheh
And they increase the effective signature of the vehicle by 1 while
active.
Ndege Diamond
----------------------------------------------------
Give a man a fish and it'll feed him for a day.
Teach him to fish and he'll sit in a boat and
drink beer.
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From: "Alan and Carmel Brain" <aebrain@dynamite.com.au>
To: <gzg-l@csua.berkeley.edu>
References: <200012271834.NAA09588@okura.cowell.org>
<00e401c07036$e4307620$6f6e60cb@Bri> <3A4A5118.B123891F@ping.be>
Subject: Re: Proto SG2 campaign system
Date: Thu, 28 Dec 2000 11:02:36 +1100
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From: "Ludo Toen" <Ludo.Toen@ping.be>
> > M224 60mm mortar 3.5Km.
> > M252 81mm mortar 5.6Km
> I'm not going to comment on the guns, but I think Tom Clancy is a bit
> optimistic on the mortars. Looking in the ASL ordnance section the US
60mm
> would have about 1800m and the 81mm, 3000m ranges. Even though this
covers
WW2
> items, mortars haven't changed a lot if anything. The mortar rounds
our
army
> uses are exactly the same as those I've been digging up over the last
couple of
> years, up to the M*** numbers.
I do. The Royal Ordnance Factory 81mm (since copied by a lot of people)
has
a range of about 5.6km. Even in WW2 3"-82mm mortars had ranges from 2km
to 4km, depending on the exact model.
The rounds may not have changed, the propellant has (a bit) and
tolerances
are
tighter (so less leakage and more range)
From - Wed Jan 03 11:05:20 2001
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Subject: ADS ... laserlight &ndedge
Date: Thu, 28 Dec 2000 01:30:58 +0100
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You both said
>
> Well, that turns out not to be the case. Page 19, right col, about
> 2/3 down the page, says that an active ADS has no effective ECM, no
> stealth, and its (basic) signature is increased by one.
AAAHHH!!! many thanks , I never spotted that bit.. makes sense...
AGGGHHH!!! its in target priority?????????????
laserlight said
> (I didn't see that "cannot fire at ground targets" bit (not that I
> looked very hard). Pg 31 says you can't fire at targets *other than*
> ground targets without your ADS lit.)
Its on the bottom of page 19 ADS against ground target.. it says the
inverse ie ADS MAY at ground targets fire if they do not have active
sensors.. Implies that you can't fire if it IS active..
I think??? ... heheheheh
Many thank.. The rules are superb but bloody difficult to find
relevant
bits....?=0)
Bob deAngelis
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To: gzg-l@csua.berkeley.edu
From: Beth Fulton <beth.fulton@marine.csiro.au>
Subject: Re:
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G'day Eli,
>I was lookign at some of the new Shard
>miniatures for the VOR game and was
>thinking that some of their crawlie walker
> thingies would make great backbone units
>for a new alien race in Dirtside.
I was thinking the same thing, though SG rather than DS!!
They've very nice!
Cheers
Beth
------------------------------------------------------------------------
----
------------------------------------------------------------------------
----
Elizabeth Fulton
c/o CSIRO Division of Marine Research
GPO Box 1538
HOBART
TASMANIA 7001
AUSTRALIA
Phone (03) 6232 5018 International +61 3 6232 5018
Fax 03 6232 5053 International +61 3 6232 5053
email: beth.fulton@marine.csiro.au
From - Wed Jan 03 11:05:22 2001
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From: "Andrew Martin" <Al.Bri@xtra.co.nz>
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Subject: Re: ADS ... laserlight &ndedge
Date: Thu, 28 Dec 2000 14:05:34 +1300
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> Its on the bottom of page 19 ADS against ground target.. it says the
inverse ie ADS MAY at ground targets fire if they do not have active
sensors.. Implies that you can't fire if it IS active.. I think??? ...
heheheheh
That's correct. The ADS fires during the opponent's movement.
Andrew Martin
ICQ: 26227169 http://members.nbci.com/AndrewMartin/
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