Re: FT-Anime designs in FT
From: devans@u...
Date: Mon, 18 Dec 2000 15:33:14 -0600
Subject: Re: FT-Anime designs in FT
***
3-Anime uses mecha extensivly, especially in space. What would be a good
way
to represent or design mecha for use in FT (this I don`t even have any
ideas
for yet). For this, I keep thinking about the mecton Z book, which had a
system of scaling equipment/weapons/whatever, that allowed you to design
anything from powered armour to starships, using the same construction
rules.
***
I'm not entirely sure how small mecha would be different from regular
fighters. I know long ago, mecha was discussed, but with FTII
simplicity, I
don't recall especially big differences, except those REALLY in love
with
piloted anthro-robots wanted them to be super agile and the like.
I suppose you could make them instant boarding parties, as I've seen
some
anime where they stride corridors, torching crew...
I refuse to discuss BIG mecha.
The_Beast
-Douglas J. Evans, curmudgeon
One World, one Web, one Program - Microsoft promotional ad
Ein Volk, ein Reich, ein Fuhrer - Adolf Hitler
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From: "Peter C" <petrov_101@hotmail.com>
To: gzg-l@csua.berkeley.edu
Subject: Re: FT-Anime designs in FT
Date: Mon, 18 Dec 2000 21:47:49 -0000
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>From: "bif smith" <bif@bifsmith.fsnet.co.uk>
>Reply-To: gzg-l@csua.berkeley.edu
>To: "full thrust" <gzg-l@csua.berkeley.edu>
>Subject: FT-Anime designs in FT
>Date: Mon, 18 Dec 2000 15:54:13 -0000
<snippage>
>1-Would ANYbody actually use a nova cannon for long range fire, because
any
>ship could maneuver out of it`s path by the third turn, any generate a
>clean
>miss (a nsl sd MIGHT get hit, it`s thurst is so pitifully low (I think
(of
>course, if I`m wrong, somebody tell me))).
>
Our group uses them in campaigns versus immobile targets at long range
(ie.
space stations and such).
_________________________________________________________________
Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com
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To: gzg-l@csua.berkeley.edu
From: Beth Fulton <beth.fulton@marine.csiro.au>
Subject: Re: FT-Anime designs in FT
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G'day guys,
>I'm not entirely sure how small
>mecha would be different from regular
>fighters.
One of the guys here uses the mecha fighters made by Nic (and I'm
assuming
Jon). We ended up saying that they could attempt to board instead of
just
doing a normal attack. If they were successful then you started doing
boarding action like resolution with one mech worth x boarding factors
(and
I've completely forgotten the number sorry). We also opted for using
Schoon's boarding rules rather than the ones in FT/MT as they worked
better.
Cheers
Beth
------------------------------------------------------------------------
----
------------------------------------------------------------------------
----
Elizabeth Fulton
c/o CSIRO Division of Marine Research
GPO Box 1538
HOBART
TASMANIA 7001
AUSTRALIA
Phone (03) 6232 5018 International +61 3 6232 5018
Fax 03 6232 5053 International +61 3 6232 5053
email: beth.fulton@marine.csiro.au
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From: "Robertson, Brendan" <Brendan.Robertson@dva.gov.au>
To: "'gzg-l@CSUA.Berkeley.EDU'" <gzg-l@csua.berkeley.edu>
Subject: RE: Miniature search (OT)
Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2000 10:15:54 +1100
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Have a look at
http://home.pacific.net.au/~southernskies/ft/hbw.htm
You'll have to wait about 8 hours, as I've just realised I need to
update
the pages (looks like the server may have reverted to an old backup
copy).
Neath Southern Skies -http://home.pacific.net.au/~southernskies/
[Pirates] Dame Captain Washalot
[MKW2] Admiral Peter Rollins - Task Force Zulu-Beta
[Firestorm] Battletech PBeM GM
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Peter Mancini [SMTP:peter_mancini@msn.com]
> Sent: Monday, December 18, 2000 4:43 PM
> To: gzg-l@CSUA.Berkeley.EDU
> Subject: Re: Miniature search (OT)
>
> Are there official/semi-official/or downright unofficial SDDs for the
UN
> ships? They look cool by the way.
>
> --Peter
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From: Allan Goodall <awg@sympatico.ca>
To: gzg-l@csua.berkeley.edu
Subject: Re: [FT]Fleet Book 2...
Date: Mon, 18 Dec 2000 19:04:04 -0500
Organization: Haphazard at best.
Message-ID: <kd9t3tsulgjoa5la0aqosrbrf0odf08fl7@4ax.com>
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<Pine.GSO.4.21.0012181445050.27748-100000@poppc.stsci.edu>
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On Mon, 18 Dec 2000 14:48:51 -0500 (EST), Mark Kochte <kochte@stsci.edu>
wrote:
>I've only ever seen funky snails, too (and have mind painted with
>Amer Indian warpaint schemes). I personally don't see what the
>others see (without some serious stretching of the imagination).
>But I guess that depends on what's on each person's mind... ;-)
To paraphrase Freud, sometimes a snail is just a snail.
Allan Goodall awg@sympatico.ca
Goodall's Grotto: http://www.vex.net/~agoodall
"Surprisingly, when you throw two naked women with sex
toys into a living room full of drunken men, things
always go bad." - Kyle Baker, "You Are Here"
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Subject: Re: [FT]Fleet Book 2...
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***
To paraphrase Freud, sometimes a snail is just a snail.
***
However, if everybody calls it something else...
Most of us heard the noise long before we saw the figs. I must say, I
had
to stretch, though not far, my imagination to make the connection when I
finally picked up a few packs.
Now, the brain bugs from the movie SST... *shudder*
The_Beast
-Douglas J. Evans, curmudgeon
One World, one Web, one Program - Microsoft promotional ad
Ein Volk, ein Reich, ein Fuhrer - Adolf Hitler
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From: "Robertson, Brendan" <Brendan.Robertson@dva.gov.au>
To: "'gzg-l@CSUA.Berkeley.EDU'" <gzg-l@csua.berkeley.edu>
Subject: RE: [FT] Starfire Bug designs
Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2000 11:50:52 +1100
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Another thing to keep in mind is the difference between commercial and
military drives. Although having no effect on the tactical level, it's
important strategically and needs to be accounted for.
The easiest way I can see is to have commercial drives cost 10% per
thrust.
This will use up some of the extra mass on the Bug capitals (and go
towards
modelling the number disparity between forces).
I don't quite understand your explanation of AF pulsers, but you can
apply
the C-1 vs fighter rules to this (requires 1 working firecon; 5-6 kills
1
fighter).
I did a variation on primary beams a while back. Doesn't exactly mirror
the
effect of primaries in Starfire, but should be suitable to FT play
(scary
when several used).
http://home.pacific.net.au/~southernskies/ft/cutters.htm
For your heavy needlebeam rules, how about:
Heavy Needlebeam
Mass: 5+2 per extra arc (max 3), Cost: 3 per mass.
Rolls 2 die at 0-12, & 1 die at 12-24. Read as normal needlebeam rules.
A lot easier and the numbers should crunch better.
For the Barfly CL; in FT terms probably 1 SMR, 2 x C2, 2 x PDS, cloak,
superior sensors.
Neath Southern Skies -http://home.pacific.net.au/~southernskies/
[Pirates] Dame Captain Washalot
[MKW2] Admiral Peter Rollins - Task Force Zulu-Beta
[Firestorm] Battletech PBeM GM
> -----Original Message-----
> From: bif smith [SMTP:bif@bifsmith.fsnet.co.uk]
> Sent: Tuesday, December 19, 2000 8:19 AM
>
> Acid SD-Heavy close range firepower. Using pulsers limited to close
range.
>
> Auger SD-Require a heavy needle beam type weapon, but is slow firing.
>
> Barfly CH???-Cloak capable cruiser, design to scout or recon/lay
dormant
> until someone stumbles upon it. Known to carry missiles, most probably
a
> mixed loadout like the ambush BC. PDS weak (easy meat for a fighter
> strike).
>
> Bug Primary Beams (heavy needle beams)
> Mass=7 Cost=28 Arcs=5 (cannot fire through rear arc)
From - Fri Dec 22 21:59:50 2000
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From: "Robertson, Brendan" <Brendan.Robertson@dva.gov.au>
To: "'gzg-l@CSUA.Berkeley.EDU'" <gzg-l@csua.berkeley.edu>
Subject: RE: Fighter Rules
Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2000 12:01:26 +1100
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Some types of fighters mix a lot easier than others. The most effective
combinations I've found are:
Heavy Attack
Long Range Attack
Fast Interceptor
Most of the other combinations actually reduce the effectiveness of the
fighter type to the point where you're better off with 2 standard
squadrons.
They're not canon (having been neatly eliminated by the fixed values in
FB1), but will turn up in structured scenarios and webgames.
Another little tweak that has been used (mainly in the MKW battles) is
for
every full 3 squadrons, you can spend 6 pts to upgrade 1 squadron to Ace
status. Its considered polite to take 1 turkey for every 2 ace
squadrons as
well (you don't get any points back though!) for character.
Occasionally
your turkey squadron will do better than the aces...
I have to do some more work on them, but when you build the fighters
using
DS/SG rules, it becomes obvious what is feasable to use.
http://home.pacific.net.au/~southernskies/sg/fighters.htm
Neath Southern Skies -http://home.pacific.net.au/~southernskies/
[Pirates] Dame Captain Washalot
[MKW2] Admiral Peter Rollins - Task Force Zulu-Beta
[Firestorm] Battletech PBeM GM
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Charles Stanley Taylor [SMTP:charles.taylor@cableol.co.uk]
> Sent: Saturday, December 16, 2000 7:34 AM
>
> In message <p04320401b660278689d1@[157.166.130.123]>
> Ryan Gill <ryan.gill@turner.com> wrote:
>
> > Our local group has come up with questions regarding fighter types.
> > Specifically is it canon for mix of fighter types? ie Long Range
> > Torpedo fighters? Heavy Attack fighters, Fast Interceptors?
> >
> > What has Jon said on the Subject?
>
> This seems to be a popular varient rule - but IIRC I've never seen an
> official write-up - although I quite like the idea of
> a) give 'standard' fighters different load outs - ie. anti-fighter
> missiles for interceptors, or 'drop tanks' for long range.
> b) a system to design slighly tweaked 'custom' fighters for different
> races/nations.
From - Fri Dec 22 21:59:51 2000
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From: stiltman@teleport.com
Subject: Re: FT-Anime designs in FT
To: gzg-l@csua.berkeley.edu
Date: Mon, 18 Dec 2000 19:06:09 -0800 (PST)
In-Reply-To: <000001c0692a$28c7cea0$15bb893e@auser> from "bif smith" at
Dec 18,
2000 03:54:13 PM
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> Having just watched the latest episode of nadesco, martian succesor, I
was
> wondering about anime inspiored designs for full thrust. My take on
the
> nadesco would be using the suggestion made on the list a while ago
about
> using the BFG weapons (nova cannon, wave gun) like the phalic, sorry
phalon,
> plasma cannons. This was along the lines of the published stats in the
book
> for these weapons were the class 1/1st level weapons, and could be
> multiplied for higher class weapons. This I find a good sugestion for
> representing the OTT weapons/main guns used on vareous anime starships
> (after all, the macross`s main gun could take out a fleet of ships if
they
> flied in front of it). This is a call to the more experianced rules
layers
> out there, because I have some ideas to bounce off you.
Yeah, this was my idea, I believe. I play pretty much entirely custom
design
games with no limits on most anything, and arrived at the conclusion
that if
you could "scale up" plasma bolts you ought to be able to do the same
with the
genre super-guns, or else they'd be useless to mount on anything larger
than
about mass 50... which seems counter-intuitive to the genre in which
they're
displayed.
> 1-Would ANYbody actually use a nova cannon for long range fire,
because any
> ship could maneuver out of it`s path by the third turn, any generate a
clean
> miss (a nsl sd MIGHT get hit, it`s thurst is so pitifully low (I think
(of
> course, if I`m wrong, somebody tell me))).
Since the nova cannons take little penalty for long range fire
(maneuvering
isn't that big a deal that far out) I will use them for a lot of
different
things:
1. Harassing slow maneuvering (or non-maneuvering) enemies.
2. Breaking up area defense phalanxes.
3. Controlling the space around the enemy to make them move for reasons
other than setting up their fire just perfectly.
I'd say they're certainly worth firing at long range for all these
reasons.
> 2-Would a x5 wave gun require 6 power points, or thirty power points
to fire
> at max power? My leanings are towards 6 power points, with if the
weapon
> fails a threshold check/hit by a needle gun, each accumilated power
point
> causes 1D6 points of dammage for a Cl.1 gun, 2D6 for a Cl.2 gun etc.
The way I've been playing it in my own games is that they still take as
much
to charge up (larger gun, larger self-contained power plant), but will
do
multiples of damage equal to their class if they're taken out while
partially
charged. If you take the genre a step further (crazier), we also don't
allow
wave guns to be charged while cloaked -- the PSB for this is that wave
guns
are potentially planet-shattering weapons, they show a TON of energy to
enemy
sensors, far more than can be concealed.
I might just go get hold of this anime now that you've mentioned it. :)
--
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
The Stilt Man stiltman@teleport.com
http://www.teleport.com/~stiltman/stiltman.html
< We are Microsoft Borg '98. Lower your expectations and >
< surrender your money. Antitrust law is irrelevant. >
< Competition is irrelevant. We will add your financial and >
< technological distinctiveness to our own. Your software >
< will adapt to service ours. Resistance is futile. >
From - Fri Dec 22 21:59:51 2000
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From: ShldWulf@aol.com
Message-ID: <86.477cd9e.27702ad4@aol.com>
Date: Mon, 18 Dec 2000 22:07:00 EST
Subject: Re: Sathar? Re: Miniature search (OT)
To: gzg-l@csua.berkeley.edu
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In a message dated 12/18/2000 8:02:39 AM Mountain Standard Time,
devans@uneb.edu writes:
<< Out of curiosity, are you asking if there are figs LIKE the old TSR
Sathar,
and would fit well beside them, or what would be good as a whole new
fleet-type?>>
He.. he Well, I'm actually looking for figs LIKE the old Sathar boxed
set. I
have a couple I snagged off ebay. Plus two boxes of Feds and two sets of
"Privateers and Yachts."
It's a good begining. I'm thinking some of the Mckewen minis to fill out
the
Fed fleet. But I'm kinda stumped on the Sathar. Nothing I've seen so far
has
the right "look" to it.
<>
LOL, ya, a "wide" variety of sizes all right. The Fed battleship is only
about 2/3rds the size of the Sathar heavy cruiser, the Sathar Frigate is
a
little larger than the fed destroyer... Gaaa.... I'm going to change the
ships designations around to try and size them correctly. What the hey,
it'll
be a fun fleet. (while they last :o)
<<As far as vermiform, I'm trying to remember if they were segmented.
That
WOULD be an interesting looking fleet. >>
Vermiform??
Randy
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From: Jim Bell & Christine Hartig <jnbell@istar.ca>
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Subject: Re: Miniature search (OT)
References: <NDBBLNJFCLOIPDGJHMFOOEHMCFAA.krs@geohex.com>
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Those UNSC ships were painted by Richard Dufault and the miniatures are
mine. Richard has been selected as one of the top painters in the FT
category in each of three years of the GZG-ECC.
KR, I thought that you had photos of the Courier and the Battle
Dreadnaught as well? I must say that your editing on the Deep Range
Explorer Class was well done. I don't imagine it was easy to remove the
hangar bay that I added to the base miniature.
Jim
Kieran Rohan wrote:
>
> Check our website, I have updated it with pictures of most of the UN
ships
> this week. I forget who painted the models, but I took pictures at
the last
> ECC and finally got them suitable for use this last week.
>
> KR, Geo-Hex
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-gzg-l@lists.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU
> [mailto:owner-gzg-l@lists.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU]On Behalf Of
> ShldWulf@aol.com
> Sent: Saturday, December 16, 2000 5:09 PM
> To: gzg-l@csua.berkeley.edu
> Subject: Miniature search (OT)
>
> I seem to have lost the URL for the pics of the United Nations
Battleship
> mini. Can someone send it to me? (Hinting at the wife is not working..
I'm
> looking for a sledge hammer ;o)
>
> Randy
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Date: Mon, 18 Dec 2000 19:11:42 -0800
From: Sean Bayan Schoonmaker <s_schoon@pacbell.net>
Subject: [FT] Play Aids Poll
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Hi All,
FIRST: Please respond to <s_schoon@pacbell.net>. I'll collate the
votes and post the final results to the list for all. TRY not to
simply hit "Reply."
What FT play aids would you find most useful?
Examples that I've thought of off the top of my head.
1) A non-loop type arc template
2) A clear template for SML or Fighter attack range
3) SML counters
4) Fighter counters
Let me know which of these - or better yet, ones that I haven't
thought of - you'd use most.
Rank 'em. Sort of like I did <:-)
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Subject: Re: FT-Anime designs in FT
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***
One of the guys here uses the mecha fighters made by Nic (and I'm
assuming
Jon). We ended up saying that they could attempt to board instead of
just
doing a normal attack. If they were successful then you started doing
boarding action like resolution with one mech worth x boarding factors
(and
I've completely forgotten the number sorry). We also opted for using
Schoon's boarding rules rather than the ones in FT/MT as they worked
better.
***
The slight problem I have is, even if you think of the mecha as a super
boarding party, it's only in one place, not the thing for disabling the
ship single-handed, unless they're Borg-like in the ability to hook into
the ship.
Though, given my bias towards a heavy penalty the 'jack-of-all-trades'
pays
in inefficiency, I'd assume poorer performance in any role. Poor
fighter,
weighed down by the extra mechanical equipment for transformation; poor
in-ship knife-fighter, lumbering awkwardly down tight-fit ship's
corridor.
Ymmv, big time.
The_Beast
-Douglas J. Evans, curmudgeon
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Subject: Re: Sathar? Re: Miniature search (OT)
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You know I just got a good look at the Drazi fleet on Starrangers page.
Those
might make VERY cool Sathar. (But isn't there a rule about not giving
the
"bad" guys cooler looking ships than yours? ;o)
Randy
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Subject: Re: Sathar? Re: Miniature search (OT)
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Vermiform - worm shaped. I was trying to imagine space ships that look
like
earthworms. I'm intrigued.
Have you looked at Star Fleet Battles Gorn? They have squashed spheres
like
the biggest Sathar, and the curves of the engines have that 50's-60's
look.
And, while pretty expensive on eBay, they are still around in cut-out
bins.
Not sure they'd be great, but might fulfill auxiliary roles. A
couple-three
little putty lumps might help.
I think it was five years ago someone was selling blisters for a buck
and
boxes for two of the old Star Frontiers figs at GenCon. Wish I'd gotten
a
LOT more.
The_Beast
-Douglas J. Evans, curmudgeon
One World, one Web, one Program - Microsoft promotional ad
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Subject: Re: Sathar? Re: Miniature search (OT)
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In a message dated 12/18/2000 8:28:03 PM Mountain Standard Time,
devans@uneb.edu writes:
<< Vermiform - worm shaped.
Oh, thought that sounded vamiliar
<>
LoL and just today I found a mini from "Silent Death"... The "Space
Worm"
naaaa, not the right flavor I'm looking for.
<<Have you looked at Star Fleet Battles Gorn? They have squashed
spheres like
the biggest Sathar, and the curves of the engines have that 50's-60's
look.
And, while pretty expensive on eBay, they are still around in cut-out
bins.>>
Hmmm, there's an idea.
<>
LoL... somewhere in my Star Frontiers notes binder I have a
"make-a-figure"
set of instructions. Useing silicon rubber, (windown caulking as I
recall) to
make the mold of a figure, then wood putty to make the figures. I intend
on
expanding my playing fleet. (Oh yes, AND getting spare parts :o)
Randy
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Date: Mon, 18 Dec 2000 22:49:37 -0600
To: gzg-l@csua.berkeley.edu
From: "Jim 'Jiji' Foster" <jfoster@kansas.net>
Subject: [OT] Martian Successor Nadesico (was Re: FT-Anime designs in
FT)
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At 09:06 PM 12/18/00, you wrote:
>I might just go get hold of this anime now that you've mentioned it.
:)
I can highly recommend Nadesico. It is a classic show which both
parodies
and pays homage to all the giant robot/band of innocents in a supership
shows of the 70s which set the pattern for so much anime to follow.
Anyone
with an appreciation of such classics as Space Battleship Yamato, SDF
Macross, Magaziner Z, Gatchaman or any of a number of similar show will
be
rolling from all the in jokes and references. The show also parodies
anime
fandom (several of the characters are themselves anime fans, and most of
the pilots are obvious sterotypes of anime otaku of various sorts) ...
the
Christmas episode (the traditional 'rehash/recap' episode for most anime
shows) is an absolute howl.
At the same time, there are serious moments and and some good character
development (for anime, anyhow) so there's enough depth to leaven the
humor. An excellent show; it's delightful to see how the writers parody
the
stereotypes of the genre while simultaneously holding the audience
enraptured with those selfsame cliches. Lots of fun.
Oh, and I can't speak for the movie. Haven't seen it yet. :(
"Business!" cried the Ghost, wringing its hands again. "Mankind was my
business. The common welfare was my business; charity, mercy,
forbearance
and benevolence, were, all, my business. The dealings of my trade were
but
a drop of water in the comprehensive ocean of my business." - Jacob
Marley, _A Christmas Carol_
--------------------------------------------
Jim 'Jiji' Foster, jfoster@kansas.net
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From: "bif smith" <bif@bifsmith.fsnet.co.uk>
To: "full thrust" <gzg-l@csua.berkeley.edu>
Subject: FT-Accelerations?
Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2000 05:15:31 -0000
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I was thinking about the accelerations involved in FT, and are asking
some
of the better number crunchers out there if they`ve worked out some
figures
for the following?-
Fighters-Capable of going from a standing start to a standing stop over
36
MU (48 MU for fast fighters)
SML`s-Also capable of going from a standing start to a standing stop (or
reverse it`s direction by 6 MU) over 36 MU (ER SML`s)
If you say a K-gun round is in flight for, say 2 mins (for the sake of
arguments), what would be it`s velocity to cover 30 MU?
What thrust would be required to move a 20 k-tonne SD to generate a miss
from said K-gun round on those 2 mins? (Although I don`t know if there
is a
phisical size given for a FT vessel in meters, for the sake of
arguments,
lets say 400 meters long, so needs to move 200 meters?).
The above figures (if anybody works them out), for the fighters and
SML`s,
give you a general idea of what a PDS system is capable of engaging ,
but
the velocity of the K-gun round should be MUCH greater to represent the
imposiblity of PDS to stop it. The above figures also give a ROUGH idea
of
what the capablities of the best drive systems are in the FT universe,
because nobody is going to use lest than the best performance posible in
their fighters or missiles, are they?. It also shows up the limited
range
and accelerations of the MT missile, and why most people (or just me?)
think
it is due for a update.
BIF
"yorkshire born,yorkshire bred,
strong in arms, thick in head"