Re: SG2 vs DS2 vs FT

On Sat, 25 Mar 2000 21:30:51 -0500, "Thomas.Barclay"
<Thomas.Barclay@sofkin.ca> wrote:

>AFAIK, SG2 is pretty "generic". Nothing in the rules (except the "if
you
>want to use em" TO&E starters at the back) ties you to NAC, ESU, or
anybody
>else. All the rules are thoroughly generic. Me and Mr. Goodall have
>discussed Traveller done SG2 before, and I think you could easily do
2300AD
>or many other backgrounds VERY easily without doing much to the basic
rules
>(just modifying kit a bit to match the millieu). 

I did a GW based game two years running at GenCon, Marines and Squats
versus
Orks. I kept the game mostly SG2 and simply cobbled together stats for
the
squads. I could have made the squads more "GW-ish" but it played rather
well
as is. SG2 is definietly generic (I was going to say "very generic" but
generic is an absolute. *S*). I have half thought of trying to do SG2 in
another mileu, say 19th Century. Any further back than horse and musket
and
the simplified hand-to-hand rules are just too silly. Theoretically it
should
work (with some modifications to the morale rules, of course).

>FT - strange you should suggest FT as tied to the Tuffleyverse. If you
run
>the aliens, then yeah maybe. But the design rules certainly aren't. And
from
>what I've seen on the list MOST folk use non-standard designs. Those
who
>stick to FB or basic FT designs are in the minority. The rules include
>beams, pulse torpedos, etc. etc. but any of these systems could be
installed
>on a newly designed ship. Some of the KV stuff from the old world (pre
FB2)
>would have tied you to a very Tuffleyverse design, but nothing on the
human
>sides would tie you thusly. 

I found that my first go around with FT was to tie it to a universe. I
started, not surprisingly, with Star Trek ships. This worked, however in
order
to get the ships looking and behaving like ST ships, I did a little
tweaking.
Not much, but a little. 

I discovered that the problem isn't FT, it's most of the background
universes.
They simply aren't that interesting from a wargame perspective. Star
Trek
ships are very generic. If you look at the standard ship types in
classic
Trek, there isn't that much difference between a scout, a Constitution
class
cruiser, and a dreadnought except the number of hull boxes and number of
weapons. There isn't THAT much difference between the Feds and the
Klingons,
either. Compare this to the Tuffleyverse and you see more variation in
ships
within one fleet. 

This is common throughout a number of science fiction universes. Even B5
has
shown fewer ship types in most scenarios than you'll find in a standard
FT
scenario. This isn't a failing of FT. In fact, it shows that the
Tuffleyverse
is a more interesting playground than most media backgrounds. This is
probably
why you see a lot of Tuffleyverse players. It isn't a reflection of FT's
generic nature, but rather the lack of features in medai sci-fi.

This having been said, media games are very popular at cons. It's easy
to drag
players into it. It's easy to drag non-gamers into it. And even if one
background universe isn't very diverse, you can always have one universe
battle another. Dean Gundberg did this with his Sci-fi Crossover games,
and
they work well. Can a Fed phaser (read beam) fleet handle an Imperial
Stardestroyer (read battledreadnought) fleet? What about a Battlestar
(read
fighter) fleet? This can be pretty interesting, if a little less than
serious.

>
>I think the only reason DS2 seems more generic is because very little
has
>been done (officially) to provide large force tables and army lists
(unlike
>most mircoarmour games...). SG2 at least included a fair cross section
>(though still far from complete) of units at the back of the book, as
did FT
>(esp FB). 
>
>Now, many of us like the 'canon' history, which is why you'll see it
>discussed a lot. Sure it has holes (like North America and Canada would
>gladly revert to being servants of the English Crown...NOT...), but it
is
>quite interesting, rich with opportunities, and a lot of fun. 
>
>Tom. 
>
>Thomas Barclay
>Software UberMensch
>xwave solutions
>(613) 831-2018 x 3008
>

Allan Goodall		       agoodall@interlog.com
Goodall's Grotto: http://www.interlog.com/~agoodall/

"Surprisingly, when you throw two naked women with sex
toys into a living room full of drunken men, things 
always go bad." - Kyle Baker, "You Are Here"