Re: [FTFB] "Needle" fighters?

Jared E Noble wrote:
> 2 different approaches that have been discussed were Tom's and Mine
(not
> the only 2, but Tom and I seem to have been the most vocal on this
> subject).

well, i've webbed some portion of this:

http://users.ox.ac.uk/~univ0938/gzg/needlefighters.html

and will add improved jared mode and the consensus mode if we get one.

> Tom's system uses 2 dice to resolve - 1 to see if you get a chance of
> success, second to see if you actually succeed.  The first roll was
> dependant on the strength of your squadron and the pilot quality. 
After
> that, it was a 1 die crap-shoot to see if you succeeded

what a thoroughly dispassionate way of looking at it! yes, the second
step is a crap shoot. in fact, it is basically a morale test followed by
a single attack, which is needle rather than damage. you could see this
as the whole squadron diving in and doing the trench run, but with one
man actually assigned to make the shot, and the others distracting and
attacking defences, going ahead to scout the target, etc. highly
operatic. i don't know how you'd do this if you were using the MT morale
rules, as (iirc) a morale roll is needed to attack a ship anyway;
require two successes to do a trench run?

>- though you used a
> standard-mechanic beam die to resolve that last part.  Your success on
the
> second roll was completely independant on the strength of your
squadron.

both mechanics are off-the-shelf FT/MT standard, chartless to the max.

> My system used a single die roll against the strength of your squadron
> (with various suggested modifiers for fighter types or pilot quality)
and
> the degree of success was based on how successful you were in beating
your
> target number.

new ideas and a table was involved, although it wasn't hard to remember.

>  I like the idea - success is directly tied to the strength
> of your squadron.

as in mine, just differently. not to be confrontational, mind.

> But using a single die (using a non-standard mechanic, at
> that) it is hard to get a nice smooth distribution, or a deliberately
> skewed one for that matter.

very true!

> What I have tried to do this time is combine ideas and integrate
standard
> fighter mechanics as well.

design by committee ...

> > Kind of silly to followup to my own reply, I know, but I had another
> > thought on a damage mechanic for the Trench Run (needle attacks)
> >
> > The squadron _modifies_ it's normal attack follows:
> > - Declare trench run and target
> > - Resolve PDS  (I still like varying bonuses for ftr types)

could be. i say +1 due to the close range, at least.

but let's not forget the needle fighter as fighter type crowd here -
it's hard to justify bonuses when the attack is much like a normal
attack.

> > - Roll normal damage per fighter and compare total to the following:
> >   (No turkey penalty, Aces roll 2 dice as stated in MT)
> >   (Attack ftrs already get +1 on die)
> >   -- If below 'damaged' target # nothing happens.
> >   -- If equal or above 'damaged' # (say 2) target system damaged.
> >   -- If equal or above 'destroyed' # (say 5) target system
destroyed.

hmm. quite nice. this is actually a little more complex than any of the
other proposals so far, needing a roll of one die per fighter, followed
by an add and a compare. not bad, really.

my biggest objection to this is the somewhat arbitrary constants 'say 2'
and 'say 5'; i accept that this system is playable, it's just not
terribly elegant.

Tom