Re: [GZG] [OFFICIAL] Question to you all.....

[Oerjan Ariander <oerjan.ariander@xxxxxxxxx>]

Jon T. wrote:

> 1) The system as it currently stands (FT/FB1/FB2 standard): ie, 1 thrust 
> point will rotate any ship to any heading in vector movement.

d) I've actually played this and dislike it.

Played it with or against all of the Fleet Book and beta-test fleets, plus 
a wide variety of home-grown designs. Dislike it because of the way it 
makes MD4 ships with single-arc long-range beams the ultimate design style 
- forget about the Kra'Vak; their expensive engines don't give them any 
real advantage over cheap MD4 (standard) engines, and their K-guns are 
outranged by single-arc B3s and B4s. Forget about the FB1 human designs, 
too - they waste *way* too much of their weapons Mass on wide fire arcs 
which have virtually no use under the FB1/FB2 Vector movement rules.

> 2) The system used in the EFSB (the Babylon Project FT variant), where 1 
> thrust point only allows rotation by 1 course point (30 degrees).

d) I've actually played this and dislike it.

Same fleets as above (including in some Cinematic/Vector crossover 
battles). Dislike it both because it doesn't really make sense PSB-wise if 
a game turn is longer than a minute or so at most, and because it makes 
even MD4 and MD6 ships extremely unmanoeuvrable.

> 3) 1 thrust point allows rotation by up to 2 course points (60 degrees).

c) & d) I've actually played this and both dislike and like it.

Played it with various homegrown ships, beta-test UNSC, ORC, Kra'Vak and 
Phalons; played it against the human FB1 fleets and homegrowns. PSB-wise I 
still dislike the way it doesn't really make sense unless the game turn is 
quite short, but game-wise I very much like the way it makes having 
different main drive ratings actually mean something while still allowing 
ships to manoeuvre somewhat.

HOWEVER, game-wise I'm even more fond of the variant of 3) where 1 thrust 
point allows rotation by up to 2 course points and a *Main Drive* burn 
accellerates the ship *2* mu straight ahead instead of just 1 mu. This 
variant retains the fire-arc/drive rating balance of the "plain 3)", but it 
also makes it easier for ships to change course rather than just change facing.

> 4) Modified FB1/FB2 standard - 1 thrust point rotates to any heading, BUT 
> only ONE rotation maneuver allowed per turn... in other words you can 
> rotate for maneuver purposes and then thrust, OR thrust and then rotate to 
> fire, but NOT rotate/thrust/rotate.....

b) I haven't played this but dislike it in theory.

This has very nearly the same effect as using MD2 drives already has in 
FB1/FB2 Vector: with MD2 you only have 1 thrust point to spend on 
manoeuvres, so can't make more than 1 rotation per turn. When flying ships 
like this most players I've played against choose to maximize their 
opportunities to shoot - which means that they'll use their single rotation 
per turn to keep the enemy in arc, essentially forfeiting their ability to 
manoeuvre except for Main Drive burns in the direction they happen to face 
either before or after the rotation.

Basically, with this concept the differences between different MD ratings 
become even smaller than they are in FB1/FB2 - MD2 ships are still just as 
able to keep the enemy in arc as MD6A ones are, but now the MD6 ship 
doesn't even have any noticable advantage in course changing ability.

***
A comment to another reply:

David Rodemaker wrote (in a heavily formatted and thus rather big post):

> (though I agree that the move/fire dichotomy is annoying at times ? 
> anybody thought of doing something like isolating all fighter and missile 
> action, plus PDS fire I suppose, prior to ship movement and fire?*).

But that doesn't have any effect whatsoever on the move/fire issues Indy 
brought up - with your revised turn sequence ships are still just as able 
to fly right through each others' fire arcs yet end the move being unable 
to shoot at each other, and they can still spend almost all the turn facing 
away from their targets but are still able to shoot at full effect as long 
as they end the move facing the right direction.

As far as I can see the only real effect of your revised turn sequence 
seems to be that SM salvoes and Plasma Bolts will always land in exactly 
the right position to hit their intended targets, leaving no chance at all 
to outmanoeuvre them... :-(

Regards,

Oerjan
oerjan.ariander@xxxxxxxxx

"Life is like a sewer.
 What you get out of it, depends on what you put into it."
-Hen3ry

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