Re: Nations and their size. Long.

>China is massive, lets call it 4 times the size of the US.  The US is
Big,
>lets call it 10 times the size of Japan. China is therefore 40 times
bigger
>than Japan.

	China has 4 and a half times the population of the US but not 4
times the
area. Twice maybe and then only just IIRC. I don't remember the
population
of Japan but I have a feeling it's at least half that of the US.

  The US and Japan are the top economies in the world. China is
>a Top economy but no where near the class of the US or Japan. Japan has
a

	Forgive me but I think you'll find that China is the worlds
largest
national economy (and now with Hong Kong it should be by a clear
margin).
Splitting GDP per capita brings it back serverely but for overall size I
believe you'll find China is number 1.

>massive electronics industry that makes great use of what little space
they
>have. The US has a multi-sector economy and still have large areas of
>un-utilized land. China, however, does not have a sizable electronics

	Yes and there are large tracts of land in China, Australia,
United States
and many nations of Africa and the Middle East that are "underutilised"
and
all for the same reason, they are deserts.

>industry nor an automobile industry. It has a minor space agency (one
that
>shrugs off criticism even after destroying a village in this decade
with a
>rocket that 'went bad'.) It does have a lot of farmers and a lot of

	Need we mention "Challenger"? What was that Mars probe that NASA
lost
again? How many Titan II rockets have had to be destroyed in flight in
the
last 5 years? Don't worry the French have the same problems. The
Russians
have the most reliable (and powerful) rockets and their industrial level
is
somewhere between that of the US and China. They really only have
problems
with their space stations. :)

>citizens. Imagine what China would be like if they had Japanese
Technology,
>US Industrial know-how and all of that land and all of those people
>properly utilized? But they don't and as far as I can tell they aren't
>moving quickly in that direction.
>

	Given the rate of economic growth and industrial modernisation
going on
(Western companies often doing the work) it won't be that long at all.
Don't forget many economist think that continued population growth (lots
more new citizens) benefits and stimulates economic growth which they at
least believe is the best thing since sliced bread. Lots of citizens
work
and create goods (including military hardware). To a large extent, the
more
citizens you have the more you produce.

>I think you have a similar situation with the Rhomanoi - sure they have
a
>lot of planets (perhaps they are the harsh single environment type),
and
>perhaps they have a lot of people (farmers, dilithium crystal mine
slaves,
>etc.) but in order for all that stuff to count it has to be utilized
>correctly.
>

	Well this is what I was getting at. A nation might have a 100
worlds but
for the most part they will new colonies with few people and contribute
realitively little to the overall strength of that nation (at least in
the
short term). Each nation will be judged on how many developed worlds it
has. That number will be a function of how many planets a nation can
colonise in a given space of time and how quickly it can develop them.
Both
of these depend on technology (they must be able to get there at least
at
lets face it China really isn't that far behind its just that being so
large it takes time for things to change over) which can be assumed to
be
roughly equal, population (both size and growth, the more people you
have
the sooner you can send large numbers to a New World) and money. 
	In terms then of the GZG background, I imagine the ESU to be
larger than
the NAC because it has roughly similar technology and development, it
will
have huge numbers of people willing to emigrate (lets face it the ESU in
the background has nations 1, 2 and 4 interms of population size in it,
also a peasant farmer from the back blocks of China will be more will to
swap his mud hut and 1/4 acre of back breaking farming for life on a new
colony world than a New Yorker) but it won't hugely overwealm the NAC
because it won't always have the money to set up new colonies when it
wants
to. The smaller nations will lack both people and money to greatly
expand
and become a challenge to the super powers.
	
	Tony.
	twilko@ozemail.com.au